Not so sneaky...

Ludovician

Dalayan Elder
Those rogue sneak / hide changes on the front page make me sad. (So does the fact that I have to actually work on my sense / disarm trap skill but that's just because I'm lazy)

A lot of the reason I rolled a rogue was because I wanted to be the guy who got to scout ahead on raids and tell the monk about what the pull looked like and assign targets on multi-pulls and all of that fun stuff.

I'm not saying that the class is ruined because that would be exaggeration, but it does really take away some utility from a class that's not top DPS / is super squishy / is pretty linear as it is. Sure, being needed for traps will replace some of the utility that's lost by sneaking ahead and scouting things out but it's sooooo much less fun!

I guess I'm just curious about the reasoning behind it more than anything? It never seemed game breaking to me.
 
The whole point is to allow rogues to nearly always scout ahead. This works really well with more traps and the traps changes I am hoping to bring to discussion soon.

There was this really cool moment last night in Thaz where a rogue found a trap and instantly started ranging ahead, dodging the rare patrollers while finding and disarming traps. Reducing general trash and allowing sneaky raids to avoid some trap trash is an idea the devs are pretty endeared to.
 
Awesome news! The wording on the front page lead me to believe it was going in the other direction:

"Also, rogues may notice a drastic shift in the amount of raid mobs who see through their sneaking and hiding abilities..."

Regardless, my mistake. Trash can this post and ignore me - this news makes me happy.
 
Traps and giving rogues some more things to do on raids sound great, I am pretty excited about this. however I want to mention two things that are potential concerns.

1) I think that some other classes needs to get some form of disarm trap, maybe spell form similar to to the "knock" spells from dnd or some enchanter pet that finds and disarms them (with serious drawbacks to make it preferable to have a rogue/bard but not mandatory). Having just 2 classes and 1 class that can do it without agroing is probably going to be rough. I think as a general rule sod has been pretty good about not having any particular role completely limited to 1 class.

2) The second thing is that I hope some thought will go into making the respawn timers on these things (especially if they are difficult) somewhat in tune with the rest of the trash respawn. Traps make a terrible boring thing, (wipe recovery) into a completely unbearable fuck it and log out forever thing. Having to send a second character to recover wipes, especially when a lot of guilds have spent time getting ports and keys and whatnot on their rezzers is bad enough but having mobs spawn and the whole raid have to run back every time something goes badly will add endless hours to the worst part of raiding.

Having said that I think it is a pretty cool change and look forward to it.
 
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2) The second thing is that I hope some thought will go into making the respawn timers on these things (especially if they are difficult) somewhat in tune with the rest of the trash respawn. Traps make a terrible boring thing, (wipe recovery) into a completely unbearable fuck it and log out forever thing. Having to send a second character to recover wipes, especially when a lot of guilds have spent time getting ports and keys and whatnot on their rezzers is bad enough but having mobs spawn and the whole raid have to run back every time something goes badly will add endless hours to the worst part of raiding.
This, not to mention bringing a new person to a zone and having to literally hold their hand through it makes me want to not bring new people anywhere and just box everything instead.
 
from my experiences with traps whenever one si triggered they usually respawn around 10-20 mins and when i disarmed them on reinhardt at max skill they stayed down for about an hourish or so.
 
well hopefully it is somewhere close to the respawn timer of the rest of the trash, nothing worse than either having to send a rogue with every wipe or having a raid cut off from corpses because a trap respawned in an area another guild cleared the day before.
 
well hopefully it is somewhere close to the respawn timer of the rest of the trash, nothing worse than either having to send a rogue with every wipe or having a raid cut off from corpses because a trap respawned in an area another guild cleared the day before.
Well phrased. It'd probably be ideal to have a max skill rogue disarming them cause them to stay down the entire timer length.

Also, bad Ludo! How do you not have max Sense and Disarm skill?
 
I would like to take this time to point out, I skilled mine up to about 35 before i said, wow this is worse then leveling up picklocking or poison making, There are far to few traps on the lower end to skill up on, it was one of the most tedious things i've ever attempted to do. If this is going to be a thing, please add in more low level traps and stuff to make leveling this up not so painful, atm jraul is leveling up mine cuz i just won't do it how it is currently, and he is logging me in for 5min clicking a button, logging out for 30 or more and doing it again, zzzzz.
 
Be on the lookout for a Balancing Discussion in the relatively near future on this topic. Most of the concerns mentions have been taken into consideration already.
 
I can confirm that dealing with those Thaz traps respawning during CRs was seriously awful even with a 112 skill rogue watching all night.
 
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