Literally every zone that isn't clearly intended to be a raid should have summoning removed. ALL outdoor ikisith (with baldakin exceptions as that seems to be designed to be a raid/phat group encounter) has obnoxious amounts of summoning mobs. Below is my post from last year about this subject.I agree. Someone make me a list with Zone/Mob name of mobs that summon and probably shouldn't and I'll look into it. I think dungeons are less likely to be removed, but any outdoor zone especially trash is fair game.
It's very disheartening when you play a character for 65 levels then the game changes and you can't do your classes tricks anymore. I 100% agree that too many mobs summon, as well as immune to runspeed, immune to root, immune to fear, or immune to CC.
I appreciate that some classes shine in some areas. a high tier tank+healbox will be the vastly superior way to farm, or do most quests. It shouldn't be basically impossible to kill yard trash/quest mobs/easy-cash-farm mobs with your kiting/cc/rootrot classes. It is pretty awful to have a major aspect of your classes play-style cut out from under you after playing it as long as OP has.
No need to change raid zones/encounters, checkpoint mobs, and most names at all. I promise if you made zero non-raidzone yard trash summon, immune to runspeed change, fear, or root....it would still be substantially faster (and safer) to still get a tank + healbox and DS+aoe everything to death than to kite it.
(and to add in, I took a few years off of SoD before coming back and one of the major factors was that i couldn't progress any more outside of raid. everyone's advice was "log in with this ringer tank i have info for bro" and it didn't feel like i was playing the game anymore with the character i made. that seems like where OP may be headed )
There's a bunch of reasons people shit on necromancers, but its mostly because at the high tiers they aren't very good.Man, why does everyone shit on necromancers? I'm like one of 2 people that find the class enjoyable/powerful/useful, that also play one. Even though there are a few things that should be looked at, y'all need to chill...
their damage plateaus at t12/t13 and they lack strong upfront damage and lack burn damage. a lot of classes get better relative to necros as raid DPS increases too, because a lot of classes benefit more from shorter fight times, both in terms of mana sustain and the fact that their burn phase takes up a larger % of the fight time. Wizards on 4.3 for example, used to have to moon comet throughout most of the fight and be relatively conservative, now you can just flash flame the whole fight and still finish with a bunch of mana left. Necro utility just isn't able to be used in a majority of fights or simply isn't needed in a lot of fights either. Also a lot of the time they aren't worth bringing over a wizard because they are either unable to do fight mechanics or do them incredibly poorly. They really aren't that great of an exp group/6man class for the most part as well.Man, why does everyone shit on necromancers? I'm like one of 2 people that find the class enjoyable/powerful/useful, that also play one. Even though there are a few things that should be looked at, y'all need to chill...
Pretty sure some of the co'dair summon, maybe just the red ones?Man, why does everyone shit on necromancers? I'm like one of 2 people that find the class enjoyable/powerful/useful, that also play one. Even though there are a few things that should be looked at, y'all need to chill...
Behold, a list:
Remnants - All undead creatures, piranhas (iirc)
Emerald Jungle - like just about anything that isn't a co'dair or iksar
Field of Bone - see above
Murk - undead iksars and frogloks
Tears of Elael - Yiv (assuming orcs as well...), fucking queen bee
Prophets Landing - Undead (minus the "raid" content, lol)
Dreadlands - a failed iksar child(s), a giant ice devourer (for real though, these things were cake to kill at tier 6-7 when I started Refuge quests... when I had someone else soaking the dmg because it summons), I believe the Nazdrich do not summon, but if they do that is also dumb.
If we want to look out to the 'older' content....
Western Wastes - certain not-named wyrms and ice devourers, possibly wyverns? can't remember, didn't kill them often
Starfall - if you do not consider the underwater path beneath the MoP portal, all of those summon
mobs also summon regardless of HP as soon as they're snared/rooted iircThe other big issue with summoning mobs is snare. I can't count the number of times tanks have told me not snare because they get this ping pong effect as different mobs summon them that are spread out by the snare. which is unfortunate since bards best aoe slow does a snare as well. Though this is more just how poorly implemented summoning is.
Pretty sure mobs only start summoning after they reach 98% life. (This does not count for boss encounter's that auto summon on engage) What I think I have noticed over the many times I have died from mobs chain summoning when I'm trying to make a run to a zone.mobs also summon regardless of HP as soon as they're snared/rooted iirc
Not true, this was a conversation in vent one night listing off various monsters that summon from just ensnare that does no damage. They are few but do exist.Pretty sure mobs only start summoning after they reach 98% life. (This does not count for boss encounter's that auto summon on engage) What I think I have noticed over the many times I have died from mobs chain summoning when I'm trying to make a run to a zone.
most dungeon mobs could be changed to not summon and I don't think you'd see people going in and kiting bloodfires in FR for instance. Summoning in dungeons is pretty annoying when you go to pull and a mob touches you and is instantly put into summoning range. This wouldn't be a big deal but when the best exp in the game involves pulling 20+ mobs in kaesora at a time it gets old pretty quick.
all-ranged kite groups will never even come close to a traditional set up due to the lack of damage shield and riposte damage, I don't think there is much to worry about.Yea, I'm thinking about this. I'm not seeing a compelling argument for a majority of these summoning cases. I'm curious of the intent. The biggest balance issue/hack I could think of is that necro infinite splurt AA that doesn't exist anymore. In general, I can't imagine it being more efficient to do ranged compositions in a lot of these zones, so I don't see the issue offhand in changing this. I will dig more into it.
summoned into geometry or a wall.
When/if a bunch of monsters/zones have summoning removed will we get a detailed update on what zones/monsters were changed and which ones left alone?Yea, I'm thinking about this. I'm not seeing a compelling argument for a majority of these summoning cases. I'm curious of the intent. The biggest balance issue/hack I could think of is that necro infinite splurt AA that doesn't exist anymore. In general, I can't imagine it being more efficient to do ranged compositions in a lot of these zones, so I don't see the issue offhand in changing this. I will dig more into it.
So the next patch all mobs we planned to ouch should be in. The list is essentially:Next patch should feature a list of zones that have most/all of the non-special mobs summoning removed.