God help us, its a BST thread

I don't see how you can agree with an increase in stamina usage. But then again you also think Beastlords are healers so nothing surprises me i suppose. The whole idea of mimic stance is supposed to be sustained dps. Which means long term use. Right now im better off saving that stam for /s 5 again and popping it when frenzy is ready.
 
Lol the hate is strong with this one.

We are utility. A little of everything. I have tank mode gear, healer mode gear, and dps gear. Depending on the situation and what is needed I seek to flesh out areas that need reinforcement.

If you want top numbers reroll ranger. Now let's get back to finding a solution for a stance that initially was a bit OP without grabbing some pitchforks.
 
Swiftur said:
So apparently you already greatly increased the stam cost usage... im super sadface right now. and now viable for 3-4 mins and then /s 2 for 10. Was a knee jerk reaction really necesarry?
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if im not mistaken that seems pretty solid in a raid/6 man encounter. I dont think mimic stance was supposed to be the new /s 2
 
I'm not hating. Your vision is just clouded. We are a Hybrid DPS class that has 2 utility functions that matter. We can buff other peoples damage output and spot heal, so can all the other Hybrid classes. The rest happens in athica or your nearest buff bot zone. The difference is, historically we did 40-60% less damage than the other hybrid dps classes did. That is what this whole change is about, bringing us up to snuff with other classes that relate to us. You argue that we can do a little of everything. So can a Bard or a Ranger, except they get consistent DPS output and we dont.

Jraul and I recently had a conversation about it, I was telling him how awesome the new stance is and how everyone is going to view it as OP because they're not used to it. He stated that the hardest thing is people getting over the fact that Beastlords are expected to suck, and that their new DPS output will become their new paradigm. While yes, it does need some very minor tweaks because of some very low tier easy to get high proc rate items, We should still expect to see 1000dps output at T13 without a long down time that puts us back to near pre-change numbers until our stamina comes back. Which means adjusting mimic damage output, not nerfing how long mimic lasts for.
 
Tevinter said:
if im not mistaken that seems pretty solid in a raid/6 man encounter. I dont think mimic stance was supposed to be the new /s 2
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If that's the case, base damage needs to increase and you can nerf the shit out of mimic. But it's my understanding that this is the fix for exp groups and trash. my /s 5 is still loads more damage output than mimic over a shorter period of time. Beastlord burn has always been good. Its the consistency over anything long term that suffers.

Or shall we talk about how amazing enchanter exp viability is full circle, utility, dps, crowd control? >.>
 
I just played a beastlord that has the spells and stances and i'm very excited to have them on my beastlord Tembo. I really do enjoy the upgrade to dps and see it as a good solid upgrade.
 
daenar_sod said:
Whoever came up with that is awesome.
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I see what you did there

daenar_sod said:
TL:DR
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Just a funny little typo there, looks awesome

As for actual feedback - seems to me that it would make sense for mimic stance to last about the same time as a ranger /s 8 or a rogue /s 6. If I understand these classes correctly those are the roughly equivalent dps stances - they provide a nice boost for a good amount of time but are not 100% sustainable
 
I LOVE the transparent and thorough patch notes being posted on the mainpage right now. I wish every change gave players this idea of what was going on, what is fleshed out, and what may experience future tweaking. It makes player feedback easier and having some idea of what the hell is happening now and for later on when players come back/join possible. Three cheers for T!
 
"Your pet Mimics the Cleansing Flame Spell"
"Your pet Mimics the Flames of Rage Spell"

Seems pets are now mimicing beneficial spells too. I'm guessing thats what daenar is loling about.
 
Other notes:

@Taryth

You stated in your patch notes that there is a chance to proc based on the level of your pet, seeing as mimic requires lvl 65 for use, and there are only 2 viable pets in that arena, Runic and lvl 63; can you provide us with the rates of triggering? Hopefully including PBAE vs. Single target rates? You also said that you didn't look at mimic as being the new aggressive stance. But when you and I talked and tested about this pre-implementation you definitely understood thats where there were concerns.

In the time it took to kill the first 2 golems in eldanels mansion in /s 8 i was down to sub 20 stamina bar. Which means no more "good" consistent DPS output for some time. back to old numbers basically. This needs to be addressed. You yourself said many times how "bursty" the dps was on test models. This is mostly because most if not all exp mobs the effects from the mob hp to pet dmg ratio isnt really effective because everything dies so quickly in a group. I had thought that was the solution for raid bosses, 6 man, etc. So like Tierilo said, i guess it's the new burn stance that does less to the same damage compared to the old burn stance? I don't really understand the thought path here.

EDIT: I was told by a friend that @Taryth was in game last night promising that he did not tweak the stamina usage of mimic pre-patch. Well someone sure did. Because the night before last I had an awesome stance, yesterday i didnt.

I was hopeful that the stamina return proc would mitigate the ghastly increase to stamina usage of mimic stance. I've played with this for a couple hours and i can't see a visible difference in uptime with pet return triggering. Likewise the return even in /s 2 which doesnt drain stam is very very hard to see. That said, I do see a rather big bump in mana. Too much almost. It's hard to drain any away at all, especially with the new pet emote mana saver. I think it might be worth looking into balancing the 2 out.
 
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"Your pet mimics your Runic: Pack of the Hunter"
"Your pet mimics your Spiritual Soothing"
"Your pet mimics your Mend Companion"

IMO bard /s 4 would be the kind of thing to emulate drain wise. Currently the proc was doing very little from my tests in rust. did an /s 9 to drain a bit, then /s 2 and sit and watch for procs from pet while he kills things. was 4-5 procs to gain 1% using R2 pet. didn't test lvl 63 pet but assuming double or something like that.

General agreements: soothing shouldn't mimic, relgon's and star of dawn shouldn't mimic.

Side 1: Gear procs mimic less than spells cast. Removes OPness of Dread Staff, Saturated Spirit Gloves, Entropy's Spine, rain proc gear, etc. Greater mana cost from spells cast, higher mimic chance. R2 mimic a lot higher than 63 mimic.

Side 2: Gear procs mimicing is progression. Scaling from gear even without mimic is whats defines each character, and what separates a fresh 65 from a low tier to a mid tier to a high tier to and end game. This side would say that mimic on spells cast very small, and mimic on gear higher. Comparisons drawn to high tier defining items being welll.... defining. Work for it, get rewarded for it type thing.

I think that if the mimic was changed to a chance and that AE and rain procs were shunted a bit, that the R1 mimic might not be the worst thing
All revamp items subject to change, please <insert legal blah blah here>.
 
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OK, few things:

- Might have hit stance duration a little hard - I decreased its cost a bit
- Turns out that Shared Power was working on mimics - I DID NOT WANT THIS. That really was skewing the DPS mimic numbers a lot, so next patch we will try the following: a) procs will be 100% again EXCEPT AEs/rains etc., b) Shared Power will not function while in mimic
- Beneficial mimics are not intended and are a result of me forgetting a set of parentheses. Enjoy it while it lasts. :)
- R1 pet will no longer be mimicked - this is a side effect of making it a det spell which i forgot to mention in patch notes
- I am *considering* making mimic stance go back up to original duration in exchange for a concession on avoidance and/or spell damage while it's active. I'm not sure what exactly I want to do about this yet, but it's under consideration.

Thanks for the feedback folks, keep it coming as long as it's respectful.
 
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