Juggernaut's Rage

Discussion in 'SoD Discussion' started by Rymy, Apr 9, 2018.

  1. Rymy

    Rymy Developer

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    A few changes in the upcoming patch:

    Juggernaut’s Rage:
    -Exhausting and Juggernaut’s daze when leave Juggernaut’s Rage has been reduced to 12 seconds.
    -Proc from Juggernaut’s strike no longer has knockback.
    -Juggernaut’s strike should only proc while in Juggernaut’s Rage.
    -Fixed a bug that messed with aggro when leaving Juggernaut’s Rage.

    Let me know if any other bugs are known.
     
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2018
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  2. Paxit

    Paxit Dalayan Elder

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    I assume by juggernauts strike you mean reckless strike?
     
  3. Snake

    Snake Dalayan Elder

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    Not sure if it's a bug or intended, but Juggernaut's Kick has a small knockback in it.
     
  4. Rymy

    Rymy Developer

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    Well the knockback from the kick should be removed for next patch. While I tested this in multiple zones on multiple mobs, apparently everything I tested this on was undead so I didn't notice any of the knockbacks. I also changed the damage from the kick spell so it's more damage up front and less on the over time effect.

    Re Paxit,
    Punishing strike = Juggernaut's Strike while in /s 2.
     
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  5. Paxit

    Paxit Dalayan Elder

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    Couple things , undead mobss in general and certain models like giants and a few others do not get the same knockback animations I think it might be a 2.5 issue with certain models and knockback type effects. Vindicators stance no longer stays active when gear is swapped out (ie. bandolier used, etc) Also the AC penalty in juggernaut is super harsh and am curious if it can be scaled down a bit as you do the juggernaut tomes ?
     
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  6. Rymy

    Rymy Developer

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    All the unintentional knockback situations should be fixed next patch.
    Switching weapons causing stances to drop is irrelevant to Juggernaut's Rage and I believe is a desired effect because some stances only work with certain weapons.
    I think the AC penalty is fine. I don't want high tier warriors to be able to consider this as a legitimate tanking stance. The intent is that with the daze only lasting for 2 ticks, the warrior should be able to switch back out to a tanking stance if they blow cooldowns.
     
  7. Paxit

    Paxit Dalayan Elder

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    yeah but vindicators has been an always on stance thats the way its been since the warrior revamp years ago, so anytime I want to use bandolier or even manually swap a weapon, etc now in lets say a truck mob fight vindicators drops untill I reclick it which is quite a loss of mitigation for that time frame.
     
  8. Snake

    Snake Dalayan Elder

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    Just finished the 4th one. I was really hoping that finishing the 4th one that leaving /s 2 would make me suffer this debuff:

    Juggernaught's Daze
    Spell Id: 5002
    Category: Utility Detrimental/Slow
    Deity: Malath
    Target: Self
    Resist: Unresistable
    Cast Time: Instant
    Duration: 12s (2 ticks)
    Lands on You: Your rage fades away, leaving you dazed.
    Slot 3: Stun for 2s
    Slot 4: Decrease Movement Speed by 70%
    Slot 10: Decrease Magic Resist by 20

    But I still get the same one as always :oops:

    In the /cm tomes, it's listed as "Juggernaut Range IV".

    Seems to work well with Warcry. Only tested while in /s 2, and it gave the new Warcry, going to test while in /s 4 when cooldown allows.
    When not /s 2, it's "just" the normal Warcry, all is well :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2018
  9. Paxit

    Paxit Dalayan Elder

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    Daze also keeps the ac penalty on you for that duration iirc ?
     
  10. odizzido2

    odizzido2 Dalayan Elder

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    There seems to be a few spells with the "same" name

    Juggernaut's Daze
    Spell Id: 4651
    Deity: Malath
    Target: Self
    Resist: Unresistable
    Cast Time: Instant
    Duration: 12s (2 ticks)
    Slot 1: Decrease AC by 6000
    Slot 3: Stun for 3s
    Slot 4: Decrease Movement Speed by 70%
    Description: 44651

    The one I posted is spelled the same as the title of the thread so I would suspect this is the one that is used.

    Another one I saw that looks really interesting...
    Juggernaut's Warcry
    Spell Id: 4653
    Classes: WAR/1
    Skill: Alteration
    Deity: Malath
    Target: Caster AE Players
    AE Range: 75'
    Cast Time: Instant
    Duration: 60s (10 ticks)
    Lands on You: You feel the juggernaut's warcry ring through your soul.
    Slot 1: Increase Melee Haste v2 by 50%
    Slot 2: Fear Immunity

    Is that something you can use? An AE 50% overhaste that lasts a minute sounds extremely powerful.
     
  11. Gawain

    Gawain Dalayan Elder

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    The reads like a 4th level of our AA Warcry (which only has 3 levels) but I have been gone so long I don't know if there's anything in game that offers that as an upgrade. Unless there's something about this tome that was supposed to do so. Maybe using the AA while in Juggo mode?
     
  12. Snake

    Snake Dalayan Elder

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    Yeah sorry, should have used the correct term, and not just "new warcry". But yes, when you finish all 4 class tomes, and Warcry while in /s 2, you get Juggernaut's Warcry
     
  13. Snake

    Snake Dalayan Elder

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    Odd, when I search for that spell id, I get:

    Juggernaut's Daze
    Spell Id: 4651
    Deity: Malath
    Target: Self
    Resist: Unresistable
    Cast Time: Instant
    Duration: 12s (2 ticks)
    Slot 1: Decrease AC by 1800
    Slot 3: Stun for 3s
    Slot 4: Decrease Movement Speed by 70%
    Description: 44651


    (perhaps the program I use, calculates spell ac, to "real" ac)

    This is the debuff I get, and yes the AC loss is the same now that I have done all 4 tomes, as it was when it got changed, and I was mid 3rd.

    Perhaps there is a delay on the AC debuff to actually show in the client, I see that from time to time when I enter /s 2... But as far as I can tell, I'm getting the same debuff, with the same AC loss.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2018
  14. odizzido2

    odizzido2 Dalayan Elder

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    Yeah that's strange that we get different values. I use the one that was posted here a while ago, winparser.exe
     
  15. Snake

    Snake Dalayan Elder

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    I also use winparser /shrug.

    Remember that 50% overhaste, is almost never 50% damage increase.

    You start at a natural 100% haste, so to speak.
    Then there is item haste, usually around 45-50%.
    Then we have buff haste, GoE is 77%.
    Then there is the overhaste, v2 and v3.
    v2 is stuff like bard songs.
    v3 is mostly clickers, Warcry and boon, as far as I can tell.
    Not sure if v2 and v3 stacks or not (I dont think so)...

    Anyway, how much difference is there between 25% from Warcry and 50% from Juggcry?
    Going with 47% haste item. The higher this haste is, the less impacted you are from Cry.
    Going with a raid set up, with a bard doing Fiery, that will give 22% more haste.

    These data are assuming that v2 and v3 stacks, if not, +25 turns in to +3, and +50 turns in to +28, so even less of an impact.
    100 + 47 + 77 + 22 = 246

    So normal Warcry will give a dps increase of (246+25)/246 = 10% increase.

    Juggcry will give (246+50)/246 = 20% increase

    And finally the % difference is (246+50)/(246+25) = 9% difference. (Ofcourse it is twice as good, but the difference in how much haste gained from base, is only 9%)



    If v2 and v3 doesn't stack.

    Warcy (246+3/246) = 1.2%

    Juggcry (246+28)/246 = 11.4%

    % Diffrence (246+28)/(246+3) = 10% (if the over haste doesn't stack, juggry is almost 10 times as good, but that only amounts to a 10% difference, in how much overhaste is gained from the base haste).
     
  16. Rymy

    Rymy Developer

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    I'll fix the spelling typo.
    In regards to the AC debuff being 6000 vs 1800, it's just a matter of parsers. I believe 1800 is the actual value reduced because spell AC only counts for about 1/3 real AC. Don't quote me on that.
    In regards to asking about stances dropping when weapons switch, that's an issue outside the scope of this warrior ability.
    In regards to the AC debuff being too much,
     
  17. odizzido2

    odizzido2 Dalayan Elder

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    I don't think you have anything to worry about with warriors using this as a tanking stance. I was playing with paxit last night using the new stance and he was melting like a wizard
     
  18. Snake

    Snake Dalayan Elder

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    Indeed.
    The biggest problem I have with /s 2, is not that you're super fragile while in /s 2, but more than you're still super fragile for 6-12 seconds after you leave it.
    This makes the stance not only useless to solo with and obv tank ect (which is fine), but also makes it very risky to use in general.
     
  19. Paxit

    Paxit Dalayan Elder

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    yes its very risky , it removes our ability to some extent on the event that the current tank dies and warrior ae taunt snap aggro to regain tankage from lets say a dead knight. I dont think enrage after said events happens is gona overcome this handicap maybe resilience AA but the timing on all these would need to be robotic exact. consider lessening the ac debuff when we switch out of this stance as you do more juggernaut tomes rymy> I dont see myself being able to use this stance in any higher tier raid situations unless we can recover from it quickly to regain control from the dead tanks.
     
  20. Nwaij

    Nwaij Game Master Staff Member

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    I am pretty sure the whole point of this debuff is to make it impossible to get back to tanking at the drop of a hat (usually a hat still on another tanks head). From what I read here, it does a good job at that. Also this stance was never meant for soloing either. It was meant to allow warriors to be ok-ish DPS in situations SOMEONE ELSE tanks.
     

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