Riposte change

Discussion in 'Retirement Home' started by j883376, Sep 26, 2013.

  1. j883376

    j883376 Administrator Staff Member

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    The ability for weapons to proc on riposte has been removed. This mechanic simply makes it impossible to balance weapon creation. With this removed, we will be allowed to create items with higher proc rates and more interesting proc effects. An example of this was the weapon Spirit Harvest, which is a good weapon in its own right, but turned a high end warrior nearly invincible.

    In order to balance out the loss of aggro for warriors, every riposte that a warrior performs successfully will now add a flat hate bonus which scales by level.
     
  2. Nebi

    Nebi Dalayan Pious Diety

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    sounds like the right thing to do but I am very sad about this :(

    Also, couldnt you just make it so you cant proc on riposte stance and just leave regular ones alone?
     
  3. mechkl

    mechkl Dalayan Elder

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    well... this is upsetting...
    wouldnt reducing the chance to proc have been more inline then removing it?
     
  4. Vitali

    Vitali Dalayan Master

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    I thought the point of it procing on riposte was to increase sustainability. Where Paladins and SKs get taps to help pad the loss of HP to just a slow burn, Warriors didn't really have anything aside from this weapon. Once obtaining it damage became much less spikey because riposte heals would help pad the fall a bit.

    I agree with Deein, I would have liked to see it just not possible with Riposte stance instead of removing it all together =(
     
  5. Vitali

    Vitali Dalayan Master

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    Does it matter what weapon you're using? If I switch out Spirit Harvest for a faster delay weapon now will the hate amount be different per riposte?
     
  6. Moraelintz

    Moraelintz Dalayan Elder

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    Speed of weapon doesn't matter for riposte that would be based on mobs attack speed and % chance to ripo.
     
  7. Vitali

    Vitali Dalayan Master

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    Oh I know that, I meant is the amount of hate generated by the ripostes now based on something like delay or dmg of weapon.

    Something like:
    Spirit Harvest has 100dmg, so on riposte it would generate say 50aggro as opposed to Blade of Drowning Terrors which has 33dmg and it would generate 16aggro per riposte. Or something based on delay?

    Or is it flat hate no matter what.
     
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  8. Obscenitor

    Obscenitor Dalayan Elder

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    Jumbers you knew how broken this item was well over a year ago, yet you continued to abuse it on Fuwok sitting AFK in (KOS) Remnants to gain who knows how many tomes..

    Why change it now? Did you finish your last tome?
     
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  9. fxattack

    fxattack Dalayan Elder

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    Its obvious that Fuwok is the real evil here. Lynch Fuwok! Crucify all troll warriors!
     
  10. fuwok

    fuwok Developer

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    It was pretty clear from how much this item was used (and the whole point of the item) that it was for this purpose explicitly. If this item was not intended to be used in this way, I have no idea what to say about how long it persisted in its state, even surviving some earlier nerfs. I think this nerf is over the top harsh, but then again:

    [​IMG]

    edit: I'm glad that people botting my character has degenerated into afk riposte tank exploiting and getting his gear nerfed. Thanks bad people for ruining good things for everybody else.

    This flat out isn't true. Other weapons could be created and balanced with spirit harvest still existing in its old role.

    Invincible to fast hitting low con blues maybe. A tier 13 tank probably should destroy tier 0 or sub-65 xp trash mobs. SKs and Paladins certainly are "nearly invincible".
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2013
  11. CharmCitysKing

    CharmCitysKing Dalayan Elder

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    An interesting post, but let's keep it on Spirit Harvest itself now that the elephant in the room has been finally addressed, that this item was broken as shit.

    But now it's pretty useless. A pretty big hit to the Warrior class. Maybe the ratio on the weapon could get a boost to help ease the pain?
     
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  12. fuwok

    fuwok Developer

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    If this weapon (which was admittedly an outlier) needs to be nerfed to this level, it should just be reworked into something that befits the difficulty of getting this weapon. How exactly nobody realized this earlier is pretty telling, since clearly from day 1 of this weapon existing, its sole purpose was to proc off riposte with a big lifetap.

    edit: I'll say something really unpopular. In light of how often things need to be rebalanced because someone sees a super high tier character going back to 65- or tier 0 encounters, maybe low con blues should green out, go non-kos to characters above a certain point, and not drop loot or pp. Because, honestly, the only reason you even see players at top tier go down and do this kind of exploitative farming is because of the endless and tedious farming required to generate the pp for charms, tomes farming/filling and tome turn-ins. Nobody would go back and do this content instead of the higher tier available content otherwise.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2013
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  13. Zapple

    Zapple Dalayan Elder

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    It's a pretty big nerf to tanks in general since a lot of their good weapons (like vah knight swords) were conditionally good on riposte proc.
     
  14. Pecannius

    Pecannius Dalayan Elder

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    The way I see it is that the Spirit Harvest is the thing that's broken, not the riposte mechanic. Why not just nerf the Spirit Harvest?

    That way people who don't use the Spirit Harvest aren't hit as hard too.
     
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  15. mechkl

    mechkl Dalayan Elder

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    Crazy idea but... maybe stop nerfing the exp in higher teir zones so its more beneficial to go flex your new shiney toys in a t11 exp zone 1 mob at a time for an actual fun enounter with decent exp/time ratio then to go to necroplis and pull all the rats in the entire zone and kill them. If at tier t11-12 its more exp/money to go pull 50 mobs on a 30 mins repop timer and wait for repops then it is to go kill mobs in an exp zone my actual tier, that is where the problem is. not flavor weapons and mechanics original to the server.


    Namely i'm talking about the big mushrooms in og that are really strong make short work of anyone not t9 gave really good exp at first and now they give crappy exp and no one does them cause i can just go to kaesora and pull 10 mobs at a time instead... you guys keep finding solutions to problems of problems.... without ever adressing the actual cause of all these problems.
     
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  16. Jarh

    Jarh Dalayan Adventurer

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    Guess only the tear mana clicky is the only item left useful on COD2. For the difficulty of obtaining the items from the event you'd think that they would be worthwhile. RIP yet another COD item no one wants now.

    Also why nerf the whole mechanic when you are only aiming it at the "brokenness" of spirit scythe?
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2013
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  17. eqaddix_diosa3

    eqaddix_diosa3 Dalayan Adventurer

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    This has already upset a lot of players that were the backbone of the 50 people that log in every day.

    With numbers this low and nerf after nerf to items that have been in game for year(s), people are turning to other games. Even during EXP bonus week, the numbers are extremely low.

    I hope you guys reconsider the riposte change and just focus on the real problem here.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2013
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  18. cian2

    cian2 Dalayan Master

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    although I generally agree with this nerf, it was necessary to be done literal years ago, and what is the point of nerfing it now? Also, this quote is such typical dev bullshittery it's hard to not eyeroll. The weapon in question is a PERFECT example of how you CAN balance a weapon around riposte procs. Marza did a lot of things that other devs seem to think are "impossible" to balance, ie. riposte weapons, healer weapons that proc cool things with a balancing drawback, etc. Also, this weapon is the absolute only weapon in the entire game that falls under your category, and even that is ONLY because it has a huge base damage, and a lifetap proc. If it were a DD or smaller lifetap, it would be fine.

    Also, this really hurts warriors, who most top players already think is a really weak class, because Paladins and especially SKs are super OP - devs have no idea how much healing they can do on a raid fight, but I guess a few years from now when a dev actually watches and parses a fight, that will be nerfed too. Enjoy it while it lasts
     
  19. Daffie

    Daffie Dalayan Pious Diety

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    I know you don't log in anymore but I wanted to say thanks for allowing some of the goons to use your char. It has allowed goons to actually semi raid over the last year, and also xp, quest, etc. I think I can say that all goons are very thankful for your generosity.

    Additionally, I have never seen a goon (or anyone for that matter?) boxing you and afk repost killing. I'm not an all seeing eye, but pop is low and you check to see who is on in guild... To be honest, I don't really see much benefit to afk farming or xping in this way... I just thought you might want to know.


    In all honest I am kind of shocked at this nerf. I am willing to bet that T13 paladin/Shadow knight would have a very similar xp experience in zones at library in Kaesora... Pull a ton of mobs, self heal, /yawn.
     
  20. cian2

    cian2 Dalayan Master

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    SKs undoubtedly can solo much better at high tier - but the thing is, you used to be able to make remnants KoS then sit off to the side of the river near the mouth and the crac'tees would aggro you automatically and get soloed by riposte. Outlier weapon, outlier mobs, since they attack 10x per round for low damage, mearning higher ripostes and more damage reduced by Damage Reduction.

    also comical since most of us considered this simply too scummy to do, but there's one particular person in this thread who DID do it.
     

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