Data, and suggestion for mage R2 pet.

S

speakeroo

Dalayan Elder
Howdy all, y'all may remember me from my other post about mage pets and mage related items. This one is about the mage R2 pet, and why some forms of it may need to be stronger.

Overview:
So, the mage r2 has 4 different mage pets. There is the earth form, the water form, the air form, and the fire form. At present, the general consensus that I've heard is the fire form is the only form to use. Please note this is not in reference to the illusions that you can put on your pet, but the base form.

Material and Methods:
So, for this experiment I had my pet in it's various forms solo the alligators in remnannts. The reason I chose remnants is because the alligators appear to be equal level and without different classes. I had my pet solo 30 alligators, and I averaged the parsed data from them all. *As a technical note, for the Air pet is was 26 alligators, because I was invited to a raid. I also had my relic pet solo the alligators as a base line for comparison. I have companion health 8, and companion strength 6. My ac at the time was 1074 listed by the client and 1248 by the fomelo. The buffs they had was fire elemental aura 3, ancient: burnout, Til's (death save), and they were in /s 3. No word of power stances were used. No weapons, and no armor. Just the pets.

Results:

Relic pet:
HP: 9,378
Pet DPS: 156
NPC DPS vs my Pet: 90

Earth R2 pet: (Roots)
HP: 14,390
Pet DPS: 130
NPC DPS vs my Pet: 102

Air R2 pet: (DD & Stuns)
HP: 12,936
Pet DPS: 164
NPC DPS vs my Pet: 72

Water R2 pet: (dd & Slows?)
HP: 13,420
DPS: 160
NPC DPS vs my Pet: 75

Fire R2 pet: (big dd)
HP: 13,176
DPS: 218
NPC DPS vs my Pet: 105

Results:

It would appear DPS wise the relic pet is equal dps to the Air R2 and the Water R2 pet. The fire pet, as consensus assumed, is the best possible dps, by a fair amount. The earth pet is worse dps, and worse at tanking than the Air R2, Water R2. The only reason the Earth R2 pet is a better tank than the relic pet is due to is 5,000 hit points. The Water R2 and the Air R2 pets are the best tanking r2 pets. I did not record the data, because I did not think of it, but the differential in pet dps, seems to be based on how much the pet's DD hits for.

Suggestions:

The Earth R2, should be made to be a better tank. That's kind of what earth pets are thought to be. This can be achieved by just adding more hit points to the earth pet, or improving the pet so it mitigates better.

All the R2 forms should be at least clock in as well at tanking as the relic pet. This is the last pet, you gotta go to a t10 & t9 dungeon to get all the pieces. It should be much better than the relic pet, as how the relic pet is much better than the level 63 pet. Just as a note, the relic pet has about 80 % more hp than the level 63 pets. The R2 pets, have been nerfed to where they only have about 40 % more hp than the relic pet. Pet hp when plotted against the level of the spells up to relic, follows an exponential curve. From what it sounds like the initial r2 pet also followed this formula, but their hp was nerfed down without any improved mitigation is not around where it should be.

The base melee dps of the r2 pets should be equal to the combined dps (melee and dd) of the relic pet. This way, at the minimum the earth r2 pet can be at least equal dps to a relic pet but a better tank.

Lastly, the pet's innate DS should they be higher? The fire elemental 3 first appears from the greater vocaration of fire (58 spell level), again in level 63 pet, also in relic pet, maybe runic 2 pet should have the equivalent of a elemental aura 4. If there is one in the game.

These were just some thoughts I had.
 
Doesnt the water pet self heal as well as slow? And that makes it ideal as solo pet as it has WAY more hp (including the heals) than other pets.
Air pet is very nice when you have many healing mobs and a middle ground between tanking ability and dps as the fire pet stinks at tanking.

But yes, the hp nerfs that was made on mage r2 was way out of line, when they took away about 50% of the hp it had at first (wasnt it like 30k hp when it first came out and for the first year or so?)
 
I did not use any illusion:

It's the water illusion that gives the gheal proc:
Earth illusion is ac and hp
Fire illusion is atk and haste
Air illusion is the proc that adds a few % to spell dmg.

The data above did not involve any of those illusions. Just the pet themselves.
 
It is a 3% heal when I used it last (over 1 year ago) before I decided it was a useless form.

In the current state I typically run 3 different setups for my pet.

Air base per with fire form. This is for max pet melee against high fire resist mobs.

Fire base pet with air form. This is to maximize spell dps.

Air base pet with water form. I use this on high ae fights to try and help smoothe out heals for the group healer. The heals are melee proc so the innate haste of air form is ideal.

As far as tanking and dps of the pets:
Tanking and mitigation is just laughable. They hAve 0 mitigation.

I think the word of power tomes help bring them into focus on where they probably should be, but a bump in overall dps would probably be a good think maybe 25-40 dps base across the board on r2 maybe a bit more should not break anything and bring things back in order and help with scaling.
 
Moraelintz said:
It is a 3% heal when I used it last (over 1 year ago) before I decided it was a useless form.

In the current state I typically run 3 different setups for my pet.

Air base per with fire form. This is for max pet melee against high fire resist mobs.

Fire base pet with air form. This is to maximize spell dps.

Air base pet with water form. I use this on high ae fights to try and help smoothe out heals for the group healer. The heals are melee proc so the innate haste of air form is ideal.

As far as tanking and dps of the pets:
Tanking and mitigation is just laughable. They hAve 0 mitigation.

I think the word of power tomes help bring them into focus on where they probably should be, but a bump in overall dps would probably be a good think maybe 25-40 dps base across the board on r2 maybe a bit more should not break anything and bring things back in order and help with scaling.
Click to expand...

If...I had 10k mana, tons of FT and the Relic or R2 pets, then I would agree with your statement about 3% heal being useless. Otherwise, with the level 63 pet, only 200 AAs it really helps when I am out trying to grind xp alone. Saves on mana because it procs so many times during a single pull fight that I see on average at 1500 hp heals and that is one healing spell cast saved.

Sad huh? But the truth is it really helps a lot for my particular situation.

I like your other combos though. Really cool and I am going to try them out.
 
A, perhaps off the wall, idea that I had about improving pet dps/survivability scaling across tiers was to add new and different pet summoning armor or weapons clickies to trash or to boss monsters in differently tiered zones. Seems unfair to our pets to be limited to one set of summoned armor and limited weapons while we progress through the tiers.

Maybe stepping on Mage toes a bit, but I'm not sure they would insist on being the only ones who could ever summon pet armor and weapons after a wipe. Or maybe they love doing that and I'm just mistaken.
 
enasc said:
A, perhaps off the wall, idea that I had about improving pet dps/survivability scaling across tiers was to add new and different pet summoning armor or weapons clickies to trash or to boss monsters in differently tiered zones. Seems unfair to our pets to be limited to one set of summoned armor and limited weapons while we progress through the tiers.

Maybe stepping on Mage toes a bit, but I'm not sure they would insist on being the only ones who could ever summon pet armor and weapons after a wipe. Or maybe they love doing that and I'm just mistaken.
Click to expand...

WE LOVE THAT! IT'S OURS!!!! OUR PRECIOUS!!!!!

haha! pfft, dude there should be 3 armor spells from low level to upper level mages. Something that would help our pets out. Summoned Silks is beyond awesome, but we need something low, mid and below summoned silks armor wise for our pets. As for necros....pfft whatever. Sure, but if you are to summon any weapons, make it 2 handers only. Pet design and all....just makes since to me, unless it's a skelly pet....they have 2 boney hands.

*EDIT* I've had 4 cups of coffee.....
 
Hesyous said:
WE LOVE THAT! IT'S OURS!!!! OUR PRECIOUS!!!!!

haha! pfft, dude there should be 3 armor spells from low level to upper level mages. Something that would help our pets out. Summoned Silks is beyond awesome, but we need something low, mid and below summoned silks armor wise for our pets. As for necros....pfft whatever. Sure, but if you are to summon any weapons, make it 2 handers only. Pet design and all....just makes since to me, unless it's a skelly pet....they have 2 boney hands.

*EDIT* I've had 4 cups of coffee.....
Click to expand...
Fun fact: necros, wizards, and enchanters already have access to the level 29 sword summon through a clicky robe.

I was not suggesting everyone get the Mage spells, but that there be zone specific clicky drop things. For example: a pair of ToT clickies, one summons a set of pet armor to your pet with great FR stats, the other summons a 1h spear with +fire damage. All of it in theme with the zone of choice, and in line tier wise with the monsters of the zone. I could see it turning into a bag full of clickies, but I could also see just carrying around the highest tier set or hitting the bank before a raid.

Pet survivability and dps scaling across the tiers isn't just a Mage problem, I think a solution that helps all pet classes (sure, even beastlords) would be cool.
 
enasc said:
Fun fact: necros, wizards, and enchanters already have access to the level 29 sword summon through a clicky robe.

I was not suggesting everyone get the Mage spells, but that there be zone specific clicky drop things. For example: a pair of ToT clickies, one summons a set of pet armor to your pet with great FR stats, the other summons a 1h spear with +fire damage. All of it in theme with the zone of choice, and in line tier wise with the monsters of the zone. I could see it turning into a bag full of clickies, but I could also see just carrying around the highest tier set or hitting the bank before a raid.

Pet survivability and dps scaling across the tiers isn't just a Mage problem, I think a solution that helps all pet classes (sure, even beastlords) would be cool.
Click to expand...
need more Lilfang dps!
 
Hesyous said:
If...I had 10k mana, tons of FT and the Relic or R2 pets, then I would agree with your statement about 3% heal being useless. Otherwise, with the level 63 pet, only 200 AAs it really helps when I am out trying to grind xp alone. Saves on mana because it procs so many times during a single pull fight that I see on average at 1500 hp heals and that is one healing spell cast saved.

Sad huh? But the truth is it really helps a lot for my particular situation.

I like your other combos though. Really cool and I am going to try them out.
Click to expand...

Try rereading my post. I am talking about the runic 2 pet in water form heals for about 3% per proc. The aa form heals for 250-300 hps per proc. thus when you get your runic pet you will probably be around 9k mana and 15-20+ft

The forms that I were talking about aren't very relavent until you get the R2 pet.
 
Moraelintz said:
Try rereading my post. I am talking about the runic 2 pet in water form heals for about 3% per proc. The aa form heals for 250-300 hps per proc. thus when you get your runic pet you will probably be around 9k mana and 15-20+ft

The forms that I were talking about aren't very relavent until you get the R2 pet.
Click to expand...

Copy that. I got ahead of myself when reading the thread. Thanks for pointing that out.
 
Shimone,

Could you give a little insight for me on combos that would be excellent at my level/pet and such? I have Water 3 and Fire 3 illusion AA. Which combos in your opinion would be superior? Pretend I had Earth and Air AA too. You can fomelo me to get a better picture.
 
Hesyous said:
Shimone,

Could you give a little insight for me on combos that would be excellent at my level/pet and such? I have Water 3 and Fire 3 illusion AA. Which combos in your opinion would be superior? Pretend I had Earth and Air AA too. You can fomelo me to get a better picture.
Click to expand...

What do you normally do? Just exp, solo, quest etc?

As a rule of thumb I abide by the following rules pre-R2:

Raid:
Fire Pet or Air pet in Air form. The mini curse (3% additional spell damage recieved) is too huge not to be in for the raid.
If there are other mages then Fire or Air pet in water for ae fights and fire for added dps.

Once you get the relic pet there is no reason to use a lvl 63 pet ever again. Use the AA forms for same reasons as above. The only real reason to use earth form is for when you do challenging content and need the hps to survive.
 
Moraelintz said:
What do you normally do? Just exp, solo, quest etc?

As a rule of thumb I abide by the following rules pre-R2:

Raid:
Fire Pet or Air pet in Air form. The mini curse (3% additional spell damage recieved) is too huge not to be in for the raid.
If there are other mages then Fire or Air pet in water for ae fights and fire for added dps.

Once you get the relic pet there is no reason to use a lvl 63 pet ever again. Use the AA forms for same reasons as above. The only real reason to use earth form is for when you do challenging content and need the hps to survive.
Click to expand...

exp, solo and quest...yes.

Raid or grouped, I usually pull out a fire pet for the dps. I don't have Air AA form yet, but isn't there benefit at all with Fire pet and Fire AA Form? I know Air Pet with Fire AA form is nice if I don't feel like dismissing the Air and getting out a Fire pet for a raid or a group.

I figured...not checked numbers at all, but Fire pet with Fire AA form (extra ATK) would pay off over all. Add extra dmg per hit possibly. Again, I've not parsed it.
 
Do I have that wrong? ATK is a base of whether you can hit the mob, and if you can and your ATK is well over the NPCs defense then you will more than likely hit for maximum damage.

I went as far with this as to max out my piercing and 2hb skills, along with my offense. All are maxed out. I have noticed my ATK power has gone up when I reached a certain skill number while leveling my 2HB and piercing skills. I've really done a lot of stuff I think most mages don't bother with. My defense is....I think maxed if not almost.

I know our pets share some of our abilities and attributes...so I am hoping this grind of leveling my skills have and will pay off. I really haven't gathered metrics so I can't tell you for sure whether there is a difference or not.
 
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