The State of Listsold

Takeda

Takeda

Dalayan Beginner
Hey fellow Dalayans,

I would just like to bring attention to the current state of the Listsold system. I understand that it’s quite a bit work crafting, stocking, listing, and maintaining items in stock and that in the current market it’s simply not worth crafting certain types of items relative to time investment, but the current state of the offerings on listsold is abysmal. Many items that I would consider staples for midlevel characters are simply unavailable, as well as items that are staples of higher levels. Many of the prices I do see on items available seem horribly disproportionate to what I can recollect having purchase in the past.

Staples that are simply not available:

- Mana augs – have been out of stock for quite some time, of the well known aug vendors often don’t list on listsold, you just have to know their names

- Basic craft armors – wyvern hide, obsidian pieces, ghostmetal, deepmetal, silk

- All sorts of jewelry – checked today, could not find a single vendor selling basic platinum jewelry.

- Reasonable midlevel weapons – mithril weapons especially which I remember being a godsend from lvls 20-40, but any weapons more generally

To most of the veteran players of the game these are primarily minor nuisance, because A. you have tiered characters with craft skills, B. know someone in your guild with craft skills, C. can just farm BOE’s yourself or go kill stuff and pickup loots on your alts. D. use your tiered characters to run through quests.

Primarily, I think this hurts newer players who don’t have those resources and otherwise listsold offered a reasonable way to get usable gear. Unlike the vast majority of problems with SoD which seem top down, this problem seems completely solvable by players. Presumably, this is a free market and no one can make anyone do anything, but something just feels amiss, and I feel inclined to encourage people to start listing stuff again. Save those junky items, some newbie can use those! Fire up the farmbots and craft some items!


Stimulate the economy!

Return Listsold to its former glory!

Make Dalaya great again!
 
You do realize that this issue stems from the lack of people playing right? and nothings going to fix it outside of the server getting a population boost.
 
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Part of the issue is also how awful listsold is for large scale crafting operations... if I didn't have to create and maintain a dozen mules to list the various stuff I could craft it would be much more appealing to actually sell crafted goods. The opportunity cost (both in terms of what else I could be doing with my limited playtime and the amount of plat I could earn by doing something else) is pretty steep.
 
Most of the people who listed that stuff were the anomaly and really enjoyed tradeskilling because you could do just about anything else in the game and it would be both more enjoyable and lucrative. That being said, the problem mostly stems from a lack of players.
 
One thing that could help is to remove the whole active seller thing, at least to some degree. There are some of these things out there on old listsolds, but unless you have names on an old notepad or something, they're lost to the general population. While I type this, I realize this would punish the few actual active folks, flooding listsold with old names unless you just increased the time to like a few weeks or something which really wouldn't help certain issues. It probably just needs the revamp people have been asking for for as long as I've played the game, and that's never gonna happen.
 
There are a lot of things that contribute to there not being good tradeskill items up for sale on listsold.

First off, getting tradeskill items can be a real hassle. Second off, getting to the level in tradeskilling where you can make things people would actually want to buy is a nightmare of hand cramps, vendor fishing, /auc spamming, and guild begging, not to mention the initial investment of the player. When you can spend 3+ hours and walk away with 8-10 kobold furs (which is enough to make 4-5 augs) it makes the idea of tradeskills for profit a joke.

a Wyrm or Wyvren hide tunic vendors for ~145p, sells on listsold for ~175-225p. The amount of clicking and farming to get those mats (especially for someone on dragon faction) makes the effort wasted time. You can't raise the price too much or you price out the people who could actually use the gear and might actually buy it, you can't drop the price because then whats the point. I have seen wyrm and wyvren hide go anywhere from 10 to 100p. Worst case scenario at 100p I am spending 350p (if I buy the mats for blue ointments) to sell a 175p item.

If you try to buy tradeskill items at a reasonable price (50-75p per kolbold fur or 25-30p for hides) you will find very few takers as the effort vs pay off is way out of line but mostly what you will do is incite a two hour long conversation in /ooc about how this one time this guy sold tangleweed for 40p each back in 2011 which also hurts new players because they think they are getting ripped off at 10-15p from the only person on the server actively buying the thing that will then rot in their bank for a price that will never come back.

Add in that even with player housing, the amount of space you have on a vendor requires that any expansive selling will either require management of multiple vendors and/or aggressive management of one vendor with your hot ticket items all of which again amounts to very little profit and very little incentive to put in the very large amount of time. Or my personal pet peeve of people buying out your stock at the reasonable price you set to help the server and then turning around and selling it at a 75% markup because there are so few vendors on listsold that they know people will pay the price they set.

The only ways I can think of to fix this would be:
-Revamp the listsold system into more of a bazaar like system (which the staff have clearly stated they wont do/already have enough on their plate)
-Make the listsold system last longer
-Increase the already abysmally low tradeskill item drops (my personal preference)
-Make auto-combine something you can do (which again, staff is against)
 
Expletus said:
You do realize that this issue stems from the lack of people playing right? and its nothings going to fix it outside of the server getting a population boost.
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Yes, of course.

Broken windows theory:

“ Under the impression that a broken window left unfixed leads to more serious problems, residents begin to change the way they see their community. In an attempt to stay safe, a cohesive community starts to fall apart, as individuals start to spend less time in communal space… The slow deterioration of a community as a result of broken windows modifies the way people behave when it comes to their communal space, which, in turn, breaks down community control… it signifies that the community cannot assert informal social control, and citizens become afraid of that worse things will happen. As a result, they spend less time in the streets to avoid these subjects and feel less and less connected from their community if the problems persist. At times, residents tolerate "broken windows" because they feel they belong in the community and "know their place." Problems, however, arise when outsiders begin to disrupt the community's cultural fabric. That is the difference between "regulars" and "strangers" in a community. The way that"regulars" act represents the culture within, but strangers are "outsiders" who do not belong.”

As i stated before and as others have reiterated the incentives for trade skills are dysfunctional and a total pain to navigate and maintain, the only incentives I can really conceive of are social, tradeskilling helps people who otherwise would not have access to gear, like people who would prospectively want to play on our server, who we presumably want to come to our server.
Ezie brought up some good points of stuff that would potentially help listsold (increase drops, make list sold last longer, reduce the threshold for skill ups), that don't appear crazy code heavy, but again they are top down solutions, they require modifying code.
What I'm suggesting is bottom up, and people consider it, not because its particularly profitable, but because it shows some level of engagement with the broader community, and serves to make the game more accessible and requires no administrative assistance.

Kedrin said:
The building is on fire and you want to paint the guess room a different color.
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Yes, Fix broken windows.
 
there are vendors with these said items that just do not show because their listadd has not been updated in a long time, perhaps the staff can increase the amount of time listadd stays on the systems logs or w/e. i have had jewelry vendor on listsold for many years but neglected to keep its listadd current because it never sold enough, but it is there still.
 
Paxit said:
there are vendors with these said items that just do not show because their listadd has not been updated in a long time, perhaps the staff can increase the amount of time listadd stays on the systems logs or w/e. i have had jewelry vendor on listsold for many years but neglected to keep its listadd current because it never sold enough, but it is there still.
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What a great suggestion.
 
The problem with the tradeskill gear is that it's far easier to just buy a better BoE than craft the gear. BoE's have mostly ruined the tradeskill equipment market. I remember when shadowsilk, imphide, and deepmetal were all quality sets on a character, but that was back in 2008-2009. There has been no improvement once these tradeskills were completed. If these sets could be dropped in terms of character level, and another set that revolves around tier 5-7, it might help, but sadly I think it's futile giving the current population.

Beyond augments and arrows, what incentive is there to do tradeskills? The rewards are terrible now and horribly outdated/power-creeped. Something has to give. How about allowing all tradeskills to be able to create all the augment types? What about getting rid of the crafting aspect of augments and change them to being world drop?
 
Paxit said:
there are vendors with these said items that just do not show because their listadd has not been updated in a long time, perhaps the staff can increase the amount of time listadd stays on the systems logs or w/e. i have had jewelry vendor on listsold for many years but neglected to keep its listadd current because it never sold enough, but it is there still.
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Sounds reasonable to me, if it doesn't take too long I'll sneak it in.
 
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